|
TV Antenna Selection for Wisconsin
Amherst Hi Denny, I was wondering about the antenna below. Round Television Antenna
Winegard MS 2000 & 2002 It states a range of 50-80 miles. We live about 3 miles east of Amherst, WI. My question is the quality of picture compared to a regular UHF-VHF channelmaster antenna. Although the terrain were we live is not very hilly, our house is on top of a gentle ridge and we have a 35 foot tower now. We get excellent reception when our antenna is pointed directly toward the station we want to receive. Right now our rotor is out again for about the 4th time in 25 yrs. and that's getting old. I am considering the antenna above if I would not experience any loss in picture quality. I also have my old UHF-VHF antenna that is perfectly good shape. I was doing some research from a webpage you have out there and you say I would lose picture quality by using 2 antennas facing different directions with one coax lead. Using this scenario I would face 1 at Wausau (40 mi.) and the other at Green Bay (60 mi.) as these are the 2 main cities we get 15 plus channels (UHF & VHF) to watch. Do you think that the loss in picture quality would be significant using 2 antennas pointed about 110 degrees apart given these distances? When our rotor works right and if the weather is just right late at night, we can sometimes pick up Madison (94 mi.), Rhinelander (82 mi.), Eau Claire and Milwaukee (both 118 mi.) if we turn the rotor towards those stations. Sometimes they are somewhat watchable and other times they are surprisingly clear, again depending on how late at night and the weather. Do you think we would have a chance of reaching those long distance stations with round antenna listed above? Would we see a difference in quality from what we have now? I see it comes with a built in amplifier that increases the signal by 9 times. Can another be added to increase it even more? I'm looking forward to your opinions, Thank you, Wayne Greetings Wayne, The MS 2000 is probably not your best choice for your situation. I think the two antenna option is a better choice. To clarify combing two antennas does not necessarily mean loss in picture quality. I stated in the website that combing two antennas results in signal loss. Signal loss does not always mean a loss in picture quality. Let me try to explain. TV signal is measured in decibels (db). A TV signal with a strength of 1 db will provide an good picture. A signal strength of -1db will begin to produce a slight amount of grain in the picture. A signal strength of plus 10db will not produce any better picture than plus 2db. Lets say the a particular channels measures a signal of 8db at the antenna. If the loss of signal as it travels the coax cable is less than 8db your picture will be good. However if it's 9db your end result will be a -1db at the TV and will result in a slightly grainy picture. The farther the signal goes negative the worse the picture becomes. An preamplifier located at the amplifier can maintain a positive signal strength even when the line db loss is greater than the antenna is receiving itself. For an example if you have a 5db signal at the antenna your line loss is 10db and you install a preamplifier at the antenna with a 20db gain, you will have a signal strength after amplification of 25db. The antenna gain plus the amplifier gain equals 25db. Your line loss is 10db so your signal strength at the TV will be about 15db providing an excellent picture. Without the amplifier you would have a -2db at the TV and a poor picture. Combing two antennas in different directions results in a 3db loss. If one of your antennas has a 10db gain on a particular channel you would still have a plus 7db signal after the combining of the antennas. In most cases 7db is plenty to travel at least 100 feet of cable to the TV and provide a good picture. The antenna pointed to the channels 40 miles away would run directly to the antenna combiner (available in our store). The antenna that is pointed at the channels 60 miles away would run to a preamplier first and then to the antenna coupler. Since the channels from 60 miles will be weaker a preamplifier on that antenna would insure that you maintain the picture quality. I would recommend the AP 8700 TV antenna preamplifier. The antenna choice could be one of three. either the PR 7037 TV antenna, the HD 7082P TV antenna or if you wanted to go all out the HD 7084P TV antenna. I hope I didn't confuse you, sometimes it's hard to put this stuff into words. If you have further questions please don't hesitate to contact me. Antenna combiner available in our store The antenna combiner details are in our store. Click on the on line store link in our site and then accessories. Best Regards,
Hortonville 54944
Denny,
I was very pleased to discover your website. Finally I have found someone with some real antenna knowedge (not like the kids at Radio Scrap and the big orange box). Here is my situation with the good news, bad news, and some questions: I live at: ______- Drive, Hortonville, WI 54944. I understand you are in Ithaca, MI – got any snow yet? Here is the good news: According to the CEA website I have access to CBS, FOX, CW, NBC, ABC, and PBS all basically from Green Bay (about 32 miles as the crow flies) and they all broadcast digital Uhf and analog Vhf. The compass orientation for all of these towers is between 84 and 94 degrees. The recommended antenna types are yellow, red, and blue. I live on top of one of the taller hills in the area and have a 2 story house with a very steep roof. There can’t be much between my house and then towers. Now the bad news: My neighborhood has a restriction on outdoor antennas. You may have one dish or antenna and I already have dish network, which isn’t going away. The front of my house faces east (almost exactly 90 degrees). The sat dish faces resides in a southwestern exposed corner of the house, where any eastward view is blocked by the house (my wife wanted it here, “You can’t see the ugly dish at all from the front of the house!”). However, this kills any idea of adding any kind of antenna to the dish mount. We have three TV’s in the house, one in the basement, one on the main floor, and one upstairs. SO, now we really want to have a non-satellite type of antenna, so we have access to local stations in the event of bad weather. I also like the idea of HDTV without paying a bundle for it and we mostly we watch local stations anyway. There are really three locations to consider.
1) Above the house in the attic. This location is the highest point of the house, probably about 25’-30’ above ground level. We are looking at about 75’ or more of coax cable run to the basement utility area is (the junction point of all of the coax cable to the house). The maximum distance between the rafters here is about 78” facing east (90 degrees), while the width is fine at about 12’ I have lots of vertical space here about 10’ or more.
2) Above the garage in the attic. This location is about 16’ above ground level, but much closer to the basement access point. The cable run to the basement would be less than 50’. The rafters run differently here, so there is a large cavern of space facing east, about 25’, but the width is about 78”. Next to this area is some aluminum faced insulation, but it is to the side of where the antenna needs to point.
3) Outside on the sat dish mount. This locaiton is about 10’ above the ground level is effectively blocked to the east by the house towering between the TV towers and the dish location
Here are my questions:
1) Which of the three possible locations, listed above, would be best?
2) I’m close enough for a medium range antenna, but would a larger long range antenna help grab more signal if located in the attic? I have read that locating the antenna in the attic will reduce the signal by 50%. My roof is a standard type of wood sheeting with some tar paper and asphalt shingles. Is there any advantage to putting in two antennas facing the same source? Does this effectively double the size of the antenna, or do you just get the same weakened signal on two antennae?
3) Is 78” big enough for a directional antenna mounted inside the attic? Which type do you recommend? Are there any antennas like the Channel master 4228 that do Vhf and Uhf with high gain? I don’t like the idea of just putting up a Uhf antenna
4) Am I better going with the higher location in the attic (but having a smaller antenna and a longer cable run) or going with a larger antenna in a lower location (with a shorter cable run)
5) Currently my dish network comes from the sat dish with three cables, one for each TV. The sat reciever box has an input for the TV antenna and the Sat dish; but I only have one cable run through the walls to each TV. Can I diplex in the TV antenna at a convienent location, and diplex it back out before the sat reciever box? What do you recommend?
6) Can I split the difference between the tower locations and shoot for 89 degrees so I can have a fixed antenna?
7) Do I need any amplifiers or will I be fine splitting the signal to three different places? 8) Finally, is there any way to install a seperate HDTV reciever for the antenna, or should I just upgrade my dish network reciever to HDTV? I only have one HDTV monitor, the other two are just regular old TV’s...
Sorry for being so long, but I wanted to give you the complete picture so I don’t end up with something that doesn’t work! A recommeded list of what I need and delivered prices would be very appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help.
Best Regards,
Dan Greetings Dan, No snow yet to speak of. Yes you can use diplexers. In your situation I highly recommend a preamplifier. Your set up would go like this. Coax from the antenna to the amplifier located near the antenna. From the antenna to the amplifier power injector. From the power injector to a three way splitter. From the three way splitter to the antenna signal input on each of the three diplexers, (one for each line). Your three incoming satellite signal lines would go into the satellite signal input on each of the diplexers. From each of the diplexers to three more diplexers located at each receiver to separate the Sat.-Ant. signals. From the satellite signal output on the diplexer to the sat. input on the receiver and the Ant. output to the Ant. input on the receiver. There is no difference between diplexers you simply turn them around to either combine or separate signals. You definitely can split the difference between tower locations. Yes you can purchase set top digital tuners without upgrading your Dishnetwork. One other thing, you will have at least one channel broadcasting on VHF after the digital transition is complete. WLUK will be on channel 11. I am confident this will work for you. With the signal loss that will occur from the splitter and the diplexers a preamplifier is a must. 3 way signal splittersix diplexers we do not sell diplexers in our on line store to confusing for most people. However, they can be order by phone. Price $8.00 ea. Coax cable Shipping is included in the prices on our site and out of state residents do not pay sales tax. The price displayed in our site is your total price. If I can assist you further please don't hesitate to contact me.
Kenosha Hi Denny, I came across your website in search of a Omnidirectional antenna. I have been reading your Q&A with much interest, but I am still left with confusion. I have found through some research that the MS-2000 is only a green and yellow, but you show a range of 50 to 70 miles. I live in the 53142 zip code. All the stations are either 35 miles 165 deg. or 50 miles 5 deg. Most of these station are blue with 8 each being red and violet as the indicated antenna type by antennaweb. Do you see my confusion? How can a g/y receive 50 to 70 miles and not be rated r/b/v? Or, even though I'm r/b/v will the MS 2000 still work for me? I know there is something here I'm not seeing or understanding. Thank you, Greg T. Greetings Greg, I do not use the color indicator provided by antennaweb it is in my opinion unreliable. Some of our best received stations here in Ithaca using the MS 2000 omni directional TV antenna are violet according to antennaweb. I use that site for distance and direction only. Also you will notice at the bottom of their results a statement claiming the listing is conservative. I also use other sites to obtain transmitter antenna heights and output power. Terrain, transmitters output power and the transmitting and receiving antenna heights will determine range more than any other factors. I could install an MS 2000 at a height of 100 feet in Kansas and probably receive channels from 150 miles or more. The 70 mile range claimed on our website is under very good receiving conditions, 50 miles is average. We have a channel 9 here from Cadillac Mi. 72.6 miles away from our location. According to antennaweb it is at the bottom of the violet color. Using an MS 2000 mounted 32 feet above the ground we receive that channel nearly perfect. They have a tall tower, the terrain is flat and fairly open and the station has good output power. However we have a weaker channel in another direction that is 47.4 miles away and it is quite snowing. The bottom line when considering an antenna is, how high can you mount it? What is the elevation at the location the antenna will be installed? What is between you and the transmitters. See TV antenna range. I would certainly try the MS 2000. There is some risk it will not provide adequate results at your location but I think the chances are good it will provide satisfactory results. If I can assist you further please don't hesitate to contact me.
Neenah 54956
Denny, Thank you for taking the time to read my email as I am thoroughly frustrated. I was once a Michigander from the GR area and went to Michigan Tech in Houghton. As you can probably by writing to you I am not an electrical engineer. We recently purchased a 2-story house in Neenah, WI 54956. Our last house was in Appleton, WI and had an antenna on the roof. We received great signals and HDTV and loved watching our favorite shows with great clarity. With the new house covenants restrict us from having an outside antenna on the roof. I was thinking I may be able to put one in the attic. The attic runs north and south and has a fair bit of room. I had purchased an antenna from Menards and maneuvering it into the attic was a trick. The antenna I had purchased was a Phillips brand and was over 10 feet long. I tested with only 25 feet of coax to the room directly below the attic and all stations were fuzzy. I am located less than 30 miles from all of the stations I would like out of Green Bay. They are also between 65 and 77 degrees. Not knowing a lot about antennas I thought I would search the internet and came across your wonderful site. Tomorrow night I plan on disassembling the purchased antenna in the attic and then get it down to the upper floor through the access hole and take it back for a refund. I should mention that there will be 3 TVs on this and the splitter is all the way in the basement where the cable from the previous owner came into the house. I thank you for any help you may be able to provide to relieve my frustration. Kevin
Greetings Kevin,The reception data indicates that the miniMAX TV antenna should work in your attic unless there are signal blocking materials such as brick, aluminum siding, foil faced insulation in a horizontal path to your ENE in the direction to the transmitter. Without your street address I can't pinpoint your location within the zip code to determine if there may be outside signal obstructions at your location. Using the zip code it doesn't appear there is much in the way of obstructions. Along with the antenna I suggest the Winegard AP 8700 preamplifier to supply the 3 TV locations. The antenna can be installed in a stationary position with the narrow end pointing east northeast. One other note, if the poor reception is do to the attic location you may want to consider the Winegard SS 2000. By Federal law mandated in 1996 this a non restrictive antenna and rules cannot be set by anyone to prevent its installation outside. The communications act of 1996 states antennas measuring less then 1 meter in size cannot be restricted. I am very confident that this equipment properly installed (I'm here to help if you need it) will provide you with excellent reception for both analog and digital/HD signals. If you would like detailed information on how to install the equipment, or if I can assist you in any way, please don't hesitate to contact me. Product Status = in stock Pleasant Prarie 53158 I'm looking for a directional HDTV antenna w/ pre-amp that has a range of at least 50 miles (Pleasant Prairie, WI 53158 to Chicago) for Chicago VHF/UHF HD channels (NBC, FOX, etc.). I believe it should have a "violet" code. Which one do you recommend? Prices? Installation pretty easy? Is it easy to hook-up to DISH network satellite HD receiver? Any other info you can provide? Thanks, Ed Ed, You have an enormous amount of channels available to you. Both Milwaukee and Chicago have stations that are or will broadcast their digital signal on VHF along with UHF (view at http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-05-1743A2.pdf so you will need an antenna that is designed for both VHF and UHF reception. I would recommend a Winegard Hd 7084P tv antenna and an Winegard AP8700 as the tv antenna amplifier. The Channel Master 3018 and the Winegard PR 7037 would also work with the AP 8700 amplifier. My first choice for the antenna is the HD 7084, here's why. The 7084 has more gain which means fewer digital signal drop-offs in poor reception conditions. It also has a higher front to back ratio which means you would have less chance of co-channel interference (overpowering) from your local channels when viewing distant channels. The 7084 is also built better than either the 3016 or the 7037. The AP 8700 is your best amplifier choice because of its high input capability 110,000mv. With the number of powerful local channels you have, your gonna need and amplifier that can handle several strong local channels without overloading, yet still can deliver the signal from your distant channels. I hope I have been some help to you. If you have any other questions do not hesitate to contact me.
Thank you for visiting the TV Antenna Source.
Denny Port Washington 53074 Good evening.
I am in the process of building a new home in Port Washington, WI. I don't have a street address as of yet, but the Latitude / Longitude is approximately N43 21' 43.5" and W 87 54' 26.6". Based on the antennaweb.org site, 4 DTV stations are "yellow", 4 are "green", 2 are "red", and one is blue. I would like to install an antenna that picks
up as many of these stations as is possible. Due to sub-development restrictions, I am unable to install an external antenna, and have to attic mount what I have. I am also building a ranch house, and the house immediately to the south of me is a two story colonial. Any suggestions on the best antenna / amp to select given these conditions?
Thanks,
Walt Greetings Walt, Looking over the reception data I think your absolute best bet is the UP-7 TV antenna. You mentioned DT stations so I'm assuming that is what the antenna will be used for. All of the digital broadcasts in your area are currently on channel 10 and up. Even after the analog shutdown in February 2009 the lowest channel will be 8. The UP-7 is designed to perform best on channels 7 and up. The largest part of any antenna is the portion designed to receive channels 2 - 6. This allows the UP-7 to be much smaller and yet still provide the signal gain of much larger antennas on channels 7 and higher. Along with the antenna I suggest the Winegard HDP 269 antenna preamplifier. This is a high signal input unit and will not overload on those stronger yellow stations and yet it will provide the amplification necessary for good consistent reception. Depending on how many times you will be splitting the signal you may need a secondary amplifier such as the DA 25. I think the HDP 269 can provide the amplification for up to a 4 way signal splitter as long as the cable runs are not extremely long, more then 50 feet. The TV antenna can be installed in a stationary position with the narrow end pointing in a southerly direction. I don't think the home you mentioned to your south will have much effect long if it does not have aluminum siding or brick. I am very confident that this equipment properly installed (I'm here to help if you need it) will provide you with excellent reception for both analog and digital/HD signals. If you would like detailed information on how to install the equipment, or if I can assist you in any way, please don't hesitate to contact me. Product Status = in stock Prescott 54021 HELLO DENNY! I WANT TO INSTALL A OTA ANTENNA ON MY ROOF, BUT MOUNTED TO THE DIRECT TV SAT DISH SO I DONT HAVE TO PUT ANY MORE HOLES IN MY ROOF. I WOULD LIKE TO INSTALL IT BY USING THE EXISTING CABLES FROM MY SAT DISH, BY USING THE PROPER SPLITTERS OR DIPLEXERS. CAN YOU TELL ME WHAT I SHOULD PURCHASE FROM YOU AND HOW TO HOOK IT UP? I LIVE 30 MILES FROM THE TOWERS AND MY ZIP CODE IS 54021. THANKS TRAVIS Greetings Travis, You have numerous channels in Minneapolis/St. Paul so you don't need to rotate your antenna. I recommend a Winegard PR 7015 TV antenna. I would also recommend a AP 8700 TV antenna pre-amplifier since many of your available channels are on the UHF band. I'm not quite sure how you would securely mount that to your dish mount. They do make antennas that snap onto your dish, but my personal experience along with customer reports found they don't work very well. Have you considered an eave mount or chimney mount? both are non roof penetrating mounts. As far as using the same cable for both your Sat. and TV antenna you will need two satellite/antenna diplexers. The exact type is determined by the use or non use of a pre-amplifier. Since each diplexer has a 4db insertion loss for a total of 8db plus the wire loss, again I would recommend a pre-amplifier. The diplexers are not displayed in our online store but we do stock them and they are available. If I can assist you further please do no hesitate to contact me. Best Regards, Denny TV Antenna Source
Manitowoc 54220
Hi Denny:
Our rooftop 10’ tripod is badly rusted. Do you have a replacement for it? Do we have any alternative? Our home is in a rural area about 45 miles South East of Greenbay WI. Is there a good TV Antenna Installer in the area? Please help ASAP, we’re replacing the roof due to a hail storm!
Thanks
Greetings,
We can't ship 10' tripods or we would carry them, we do have the 5' tripods. Usually unless you have a structure or some sort of blockage in the immediate vicinity that an additional 5 feet of elevation would get the antenna over and give you a line of sight to the transmitter, 5 feet will make little or no difference in reception. An alternative to a tripod may be an eave mount as pictured below
The eave mount is one of my favorite mounts, it doesn't require penetration into the roof and it's fairly simple to install I'm sorry but I do not know of an installer in your area. If I can assist you further please don't hesitate to contact me.
Best Regards,
Denny
TV Antenna Source
http://www.dennysantennaservice.com
Denny:
Thanks for your quick response. I’ll try my antenna at this height first to see if satisfactory and clear of the trees near by. Also, as an alternative, I’ve heard there’s some kind of high gain low profile HD antenna for local channels. This type has brackets mounted directly to the directTV satellite dish. If you have something like that please give me some info. With your assistance, I believe I wouldn’t have any problem to install any kind!
Thanks again Diem,
The first thing you need to understand HDTV antennas do not exist. In terms of reception digital broadcast are the same as analog. They both use the same frequency band, they travel through the air the same. The only difference is digital signals are carrying 0's and 1's while analog carries radio frequency (RF). There are lots of claims about miracle antennas out there, but anytime you reduce the size or shape you give up performance. Take the MS 2000 round TV antenna we carry. That antenna is the closest thing I have found that could be called a miracle antenna. I think the MS 2000 would be a good choice for your location. However I would be the first to admit that if your in a moderately difficult reception area, low elevation or have obstructions it's not the antenna of choice. A larger conventional antenna is what is needed. We can't change the laws of physics. Anytime you reduce the size of the antenna you are reducing its ability to use the entire wave length to capture the signal. Notice how most all convention antennas are 110 inches wide no matter how long they are. That's because the widest wave length is, you guessed it, 110 inches. So be careful or you will be one of those people that buy two antennas, to get one that works.
Best Regards,Denny
TV Antenna Source
http://www.dennysantennaservice.com Denny:
I’ve read all of your Q&A’s in your web site and learnt quite a bit! It sounds like I’d have to do it myself with your help. I’d like to get that MS2000 with the eave mount. Before cutting the order, I need answers for some questions below:
Please check if I’d be able to capture all channels from Green Bay, WI. This is my address: ________ Manitowoc, WI 54220. I have 5 TV’s including 1 HDTV. Can I just leave the whole distribution System inside alone. I have cables every where for both antenna and directTV, it’d be a frustrating task for a dummy like me to sort them out I’m currently using a Channel Master antenna with a rotor. To simplify the installation, can I just use the existing coax cable for the new antenna and just replace the power box inside with the Winegard power box? Since the MS2000 is small and light, can I use a shaft with brackets attached to the directTV Satelite disc? What do you think? Do you have one of those? Is it OK to paint the Mast? Thank you so much for your great knowledge. Diem, You should get all the Green Bay channels without any problem. For best results be sure the antenna is mounted above the highest roofline. I wouldn't add anything such as the MS 2000 to the satellite dish. Satellite dishes have to be precisely pointed, any minor movement can cause signal drop on the satellite. Yes you can paint mast pipe. Clean it good to remove any oil left from manufacturing. Yes you can use your existing coax cable. However, I would suggest a distribution amplifier such as the DA 25 if you don't already have one. Located ahead of your signal splitter a distribution amplifier will insure signal strength is maintained as the signal travels through the splitter and wires to the TV's. We have recently added a new page to our site it's called how to install a eave mount you may want to check it out if you haven't already. Regards, Denny
Waupun 53963 I live about 50-60 miles from any TV station signals. I would like an amplifier and antenna that would help in reception of signals. I have a 40' tower to mount on. In your opinion what would work best for me?
Kevin Kevin, Please send your City State and zip code so I may better help you. Thanks,
Denny Denny its Waupun WI 53963 Greetings Kevin, You have numerous channels to choose from at your location, all approximately 60 miles away. The PR 7037 and the HD 7082 perform equally well. As well built as the 7037 is the 7082 is even better and will last longer. I believe the HD series antennas are the best built antennas available. Madison, Green Bay and Milwaukee are all within range of your location. Each city has one of each broadcast network available. You could choose to install a rotor and receive all three cities by rotating the antenna, or simply point the antenna at the city of your choice. If you don't already have a rotor the Channel Master 9521 antenna rotor is the best. I believe the equipment above will provide excellent reception at your location. If I can assist you further Kevin, please don't hesitate to contact me. Best Regards,
Denny
Westbend (Newburge) 53090 I was wondering if you could help me find a good antennna that would work the best for me in my area. My location is village of newburge, city of west bend, wi. And I want a antenna that can pick up a 85 mile
range, good clarity, and also hdtv ready, thanks much
--jon Greetings, Several factors will determine whether you can get any antenna to provide good clarity at a distance of 85 miles. Factors like, elevation of the receiving and transmitting antennas, output power and frequency of the broadcast signal, and the terrain. The best combination for long range TV reception is the Winegard HD 7084P TV antenna along with the Channel Master 7777 antenna preamplifier. Both of these items will make the transition to digital/HD without notice. If I can assist you further please don't hesitate to contact me. Denny |
|
